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additive bow stat stacking, penalties for specialization too great #5175

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yeetgrenadewastaken opened this issue Dec 24, 2023 · 1 comment
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1.18 Issue affects 1.18 Enhancement Issue or pull request addresses a change to an existing functional feature

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@yeetgrenadewastaken
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Minecraft Version

1.18.1

Forge Version

40.2.10

Mantle Version

1.9.45

Tinkers' Construct Version

3.6.4.113

Problem description

Additive stacking on bow parts heavily limits how one can reasonably specialize their bow by imposing ridiculous penalties for using multiple parts that reduce one stat. The main issue are parts that reduce draw speed, such as iron and Manyullyn. as an example, a longbow with two Manyullyn limbs draws more then 3 times slower then a base longbow for a mere 1.5 times increased velocity, reducing your dps by more then 50% with no way to offset this by increasing the draw speed some other way. This additive stacking is also inconsistent with the rest of the mod, as generally all stats except for base damage, mining speed, and durability are multiplicative. Additionally, certain materials feel like the cost almost always outweighs the benefit. examples that come to mind (for limb materials) are rose gold and manyullyn, which are detrimental in opposite ways. despite being tier 3 and 4 materials respectively, putting one of each of these on a bow results in something which is arguably about the same power as a base wooden longbow, and putting two of either will completely destroy one stat, making the bow near-unusable.

Suggested solution

  1. make bow part stats multiplicative, not additive. as an example of what this would do, a current longbow with a wooden grip and 2 manyullyn limbs has 0.3 draw speed, 1.5 velocity, and 0.45 velocity. with multiplicative stats, it would instead have a 1.56 velocity, 0.42 draw speed, and 0.54 accuracy.
  2. reduce the downsides of most bow limb parts, especially higher tier ones.

Alternatives considered

add modifiers that allow one to augment the velocity and draw speed of the bow, on top of the already existing ones for accuracy and base damage. While this would help remedy the issue somewhat, it wouldn't solve the underlying problem at all and might lead to other more major balancing issues.

Additional context

n/a

Searched for existing enhancement?

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@yeetgrenadewastaken yeetgrenadewastaken added 1.18 Issue affects 1.18 Enhancement Issue or pull request addresses a change to an existing functional feature Unreviewed Issue is new and is awaiting the team to review it labels Dec 24, 2023
@KnightMiner
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I don't think its as extreme as your post is saying, as you are forgetting one of the most important factors: ranged weapons are not melee weapons. On a melee weapon, strength is almost exclusively DPS. But on a ranged weapon there are a ton more factors.

Ranged weapons take time to aim and take more effort to hit the target. There is a benefit to a large damage shot particular against flying enemies like blazes or the ender dragon who have attack patterns that prevent them from always being an available target. Even a large drawspeed hit will not be a significant issue if you just cannot fire at full speed. Higher velocity also means you preserve ammo, which may be important in some settings.

High drawspeed is the option you choose for DPS, and if I recall the numbers are set so drawspeed will give you a net gain to DPS but the cost is of course using ammo faster. You are not just going to get a bow thats superior to vanilla in every way. Like literally everything else in the mod, there are tradeoffs. It sounds to me overall that you want light bows instead of heavy bows.

@KnightMiner KnightMiner removed the Unreviewed Issue is new and is awaiting the team to review it label Feb 21, 2024
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Labels
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